Politics

[Jonas]

Everyone here burn a bag of money and watch the world turn to shit!!! MUHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!

[Mersh]

Go back to pre-1913, protect yourself against government tyranny (ar-15 v. modern US military), get rid of food stamps (one of the most stimulative programs), only use specie as currency, China doesn't need us, etc...where to start?

[Mersh]

When people start from the Ron Paul end times shit as a baseline argument, I don't know how anyone can take that seriously. There are arguments to be made and discussion to be had, but for Christ's sake...

[mario]

Originally Posted by FiddySpence yes, there is always one example of anything. that doesn't mean the rich will en masse leave the country. there are plenty of rich liberals who don't mind their tax rate going up.

I'm not in this argument, but I'll try to keep it fair from time to time.

A ton of musicians in the 60s or 70s left Brittain due to the high taxes. Keith Richards talks about it extensively in his biography.

[Tambourine Man]

Originally Posted by Mersh Go back to pre-1913, protect yourself against government tyranny (ar-15 v. modern US military), get rid of food stamps (one of the most stimulative programs), only use specie as currency, China doesn't need us, etc...where to start?

Are you serious about food stamps being stimulative? I see people buying junk food with them at my grocery store. I guess it's stimulating some rich grocery store owners. That's the thing about welfare, it usually helps the rich more than it helps the poor.

[Mersh]

Originally Posted by Tambourine Man Are you serious about food stamps being stimulative? I see people buying junk food with them at my grocery store. I guess it's stimulating some rich grocery store owners. That's the thing about welfare, it usually helps the rich more than it helps the poor.

they actually are

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hardly the larger point though

[Tambourine Man]

It's stimulating to the economy in the same way that buying a house was stimulating before 2008. Prosperity does not come from taxing people/ printing money and giving it to people to buy food they don't need at the grocery store.

[Mersh]

Originally Posted by Tambourine Man It's stimulating to the economy in the same way that buying a house was stimulating before 2008. Prosperity does not come from taxing people/ printing money and giving it to people to buy food they don't need at the grocery store.

Food they don't need?

I wasn't claiming it is a road to prosperity. It was a small part of a larger argument that was being made which is basically, "the 1800s were great!" I think that is ridiculous, but as with most libertarians or whatever people of the Ron Paul ilk are calling themselves these days, there isn't ever much reasonable discussion. The government is always out to get you, taxes are theft at gun point and do nothing of use, freedom, liberty, rinse, repeat.

[Mersh]

But yeah, I really knew better than to get involved in this here and I did anyway. It is really my fault.

[Tambourine Man]

Originally Posted by Mersh Food they don't need? I wasn't claiming it is a road to prosperity. It was a small part of a larger argument that was being made which is basically, "the 1800s were great!" I think that is ridiculous, but as with most libertarians or whatever people of the Ron Paul ilk are calling themselves these days, there isn't ever much reasonable discussion. The government is always out to get you, taxes are theft at gun point and do nothing of use, freedom, liberty, rinse, repeat.

Why is it ridiculous that we identify with the economic policy of a certain time as being a model that we should follow?

To me it's ridiculous for people like you to think stimulating the economy comes from money printing, which is the main way everything is funded. Look how that has worked for other countries who have destroyed their currencies. What makes you think this time will be any different?

[inmytree]

Because there seems to be no willingness on your part to recognize that what worked in the 1800's may not work now.

[FiddySpence]

a killer drinking game could be made out of the amount of times tamby references printing money

[Tambourine Man]

Originally Posted by inmytree Because there seems to be no willingness on your part to recognize that what worked in the 1800's may not work now.

People here want to go back to the way things were 2000 years ago. The Roman Empire diluted the metals and thought that prosperity could come from fooling the people about the value of money. Doesn't work.

[Mersh]

Originally Posted by Tambourine Man Why is it ridiculous that we identify with the economic policy of a certain time as being a model that we should follow? To me it's ridiculous for people like you to think stimulating the economy comes from money printing, which is the main way everything is funded. Look how that has worked for other countries who have destroyed their currencies. What makes you think this time will be any different?

I'm not advocating we print ourselves into oblivion, but I guess that is just anyone who disagrees with you.

[Mersh]

Just for the sake of curiousity, what are your top 5 books? I mean non-fiction history, poly sci, economics, etc. books.

[Mersh]

Also, the multiple Panics and economic depressions of the 1800s were great.

[Tambourine Man]

Originally Posted by Mersh Just for the sake of curiousity, what are your top 5 books? I mean non-fiction history, poly sci, economics, etc. books.

End The Fed - Ron Paul

The Real Crash: America's Coming Bankruptcy - Peter Schiff

America's Great Depression - Murray Rothbard

The Road To Serfdom - FA Hayek

[inmytree]

Originally Posted by Tambourine Man People here want to go back to the way things were 2000 years ago. The Roman Empire diluted the metals and thought that prosperity could come from fooling the people about the value of money. Doesn't work.

You're the only person in here I recall suggesting that we base economic policy on a particular period in history. But good attempt at completely avoiding what I said.

Look, if you want to go down the strict libertarian view, all the power to you, but I don't think you should be upset if people don't see your views as grounded in reality. You're advocating a utopia instead of a game plan.

[Tambourine Man]

Originally Posted by Mersh Also, the multiple Panics and economic depressions of the 1800s were great.

That stuff happens, but in a free market system the market cleanses itself and the problem goes away quickly. When the government gets involved, you delay the agony. The Great Depression was caused by government intervention, which is why it lasted do long. Same with the crisis we're in now. If we would have let the banks fail and lowered taxes, this all would be over.

[Tambourine Man]

Originally Posted by inmytree You're the only person in here I recall suggesting that we base economic policy on a particular period in history. But good attempt at completely avoiding what I said. Look, if you want to go down the strict libertarian view, all the power to you, but I don't think you should be upset if people don't see your views as grounded in reality. You're advocating a utopia instead of a game plan.

Libertarians have practical solutions to every problem we face. It's not idealistic or a utopia, it could happen if the people wanted it. People are getting too much free stuff from the government to understand/care about what's going on.