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Old 12-13-2020, 09:36 PM   #141
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You're not wrong. I think the mix killed my perception of 12/8/98
Iíd be interested to hear the tape to see if I agree. I definitely donít have the same perception of the show it seems others have. Iím sure in 1998 this set list was viewed differently for sure.
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Old 12-14-2020, 12:20 AM   #142
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I don’t know what anyone is hearing about the mix being bad. I don’t know everything but I have mixes I dislike, and to me, it’s just the default copy + paste comment about this. If it’s not your favorite mix then it isn’t. But people talk about it ruining the release like it’s the Gorge boxed set. I don’t get it.
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Old 12-14-2020, 12:27 AM   #143
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I think the mix hurts the last stop and it’s because it buried roi at the outro. I’ve always felt that way and was hoping to be misremembering but I listened to a lot of last stops from 98 in the last few weeks. This one was totally missing the punch without Roi being loud enough. Carter’s snare is also very loud. While that doesn’t take too much away it is a bit annoying. Those are my main issues.
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Old 12-14-2020, 10:56 AM   #144
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those are nice moments, but nothing from 12/7 is on the level of Seek Up and Last Stop to me, and if we had 12/7, I think we'd want those more than we'd say, "yeah but we have Pig, short Recently and Crash."
See yeah, this is always the way I've thought of it too, and throw the #41 in there too. I don't think it's clear cut at all as to whether 12/7 or 12/8 is better. 12/8 is really fucking good too. I think part of this is totally wanting something we don't have (a 12/7 release).
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Old 12-14-2020, 11:07 AM   #145
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See yeah, this is always the way I've thought of it too, and throw the #41 in there too. I don't think it's clear cut at all as to whether 12/7 or 12/8 is better. 12/8 is really fucking good too. I think part of this is totally wanting something we don't have (a 12/7 release).
Well we already had the #41 on the WH disc. But i do agree not having it is why its so desirable.
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Old 12-14-2020, 02:44 PM   #146
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Well we already had the #41 on the WH disc. But i do agree not having it is why its so desirable.
Oh yeah, forgot about that.
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Old 12-15-2020, 01:49 AM   #147
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12/7 is a better show than 12/8, when it gets released you'll see why. There's an energy from it. I also think the mix for LT1 is crap, but compared to some other mixes, it's probably somewhere in the middle for DMB releases. There's things about it I hate, but it's not a "terrible" mix overall, just some bad choices (loud and badly mixed snare, sax too low in spots, etc, too much reverb/slapback, etc.)
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Old 12-15-2020, 07:55 AM   #148
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I mean, most of us have heard them many, many times. Some of us were there. I don’t think one is clearly better than the other, but i do think CH is right in that 12/8 had more highlights.
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Old 12-15-2020, 09:47 AM   #149
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12/7 is a better show than 12/8, when it gets released you'll see why. There's an energy from it. I also think the mix for LT1 is crap, but compared to some other mixes, it's probably somewhere in the middle for DMB releases. There's things about it I hate, but it's not a "terrible" mix overall, just some bad choices (loud and badly mixed snare, sax too low in spots, etc, too much reverb/slapback, etc.)
I have always been in the 12.7.98 camp. One of my top 3 shows of all time.
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Old 12-15-2020, 10:29 AM   #150
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12/7 is a better show than 12/8, when it gets released you'll see why. There's an energy from it. I also think the mix for LT1 is crap, but compared to some other mixes, it's probably somewhere in the middle for DMB releases. There's things about it I hate, but it's not a "terrible" mix overall, just some bad choices (loud and badly mixed snare, sax too low in spots, etc, too much reverb/slapback, etc.)
it's crap
somewhere in the middle
not a terrible mix
just some bad choices

all used in a two sentence span. aka, it's fine.
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Old 12-15-2020, 11:54 AM   #151
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I've never had a problem with the mix.
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Old 12-15-2020, 12:46 PM   #152
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I think 12/7 is more of a true "Christmas" show.

Also, if we compare the highlights i get

12/8
Seek Up
Linus & Lucky
Rapunzel
#41
DIDO
IBYU
Last Stop

12/7
Linus & Lucy
Rapunzel
Nancies
Warehouse
Christmas time is here
Rhyme
Pig
Two Step
LIOG
Christmas Song
Halloween

There could be quite a bit of my own personal song bias in there. IDK.
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Old 12-15-2020, 02:58 PM   #153
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The only problem I recall with the mix is that they took the life out of Roi's sax sound. It's not super always noticeable but at the end of the Last Stop Jam it is extra disappointing.
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Old 12-15-2020, 03:48 PM   #154
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I just think the Seek Up, #41, and Last Stop are better than anything on 12/7. But the middle parts of 12/8 are not as good as most of 12/7. It's a tough call.
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Old 12-15-2020, 07:00 PM   #155
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The only problem I recall with the mix is that they took the life out of Roi's sax sound. It's not super always noticeable but at the end of the Last Stop Jam it is extra disappointing.
Totally. this has entirely shaded my opinion of the show. I get the context and why people love it, but the live release just doesnt do it justice.
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Old 12-15-2020, 10:28 PM   #156
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I do remember some people on the boards not thrilled with the mix when this was released. Probably because the WH5 Vol. 1 mix was very balanced and smooth, however, a lot of Bela's additions in #41 cannot be heard on the WH5 mix (as nice as it sounds) so there were some forgiveness there.

A LOT of this is bias because it was a show I attended, but I have never once had a problem with the production of LT1. Sure, some things could have been balanced a little better but overall; the crowd, Butch, Dave's guitar cuts right through, Carter's snare almost sounding like fireworks at some points during the show, all this adds to my love of the mix from this release.

I always felt like 12/7 and 12/8 belonged together. I feel like you can't talk about one without the other, just like 12/7 and 12/8/93. Q&U-5 (anyone remember that?)

Anyway, I think for the first Live Trax release, they 1,000% got it right with this show.
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Old 12-15-2020, 11:02 PM   #157
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Sort of feel like I’m in the twilight zone with people knocking this show. Before this series started, this show was one of the most clamored for to be released. 12/7 would be a perfect compliment at some point, but that shouldn’t take away from this show. As for the mix, some of the criticisms seem nit picky, but to each their own. I don’t think it takes away from the show.
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Old 12-16-2020, 09:23 AM   #158
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Sort of feel like Iím in the twilight zone with people knocking this show. Before this series started, this show was one of the most clamored for to be released. 12/7 would be a perfect compliment at some point, but that shouldnít take away from this show. As for the mix, some of the criticisms seem nit picky, but to each their own. I donít think it takes away from the show.
Well, there are like two people actually knocking the show. It is universally loved. There will always be a few vocal outlier. It is on most people's top 5 / 10 lists.
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Old 12-16-2020, 10:25 AM   #159
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I do remember some people on the boards not thrilled with the mix when this was released. Probably because the WH5 Vol. 1 mix was very balanced and smooth, however, a lot of Bela's additions in #41 cannot be heard on the WH5 mix (as nice as it sounds) so there were some forgiveness there.

A LOT of this is bias because it was a show I attended, but I have never once had a problem with the production of LT1. Sure, some things could have been balanced a little better but overall; the crowd, Butch, Dave's guitar cuts right through, Carter's snare almost sounding like fireworks at some points during the show, all this adds to my love of the mix from this release.

I always felt like 12/7 and 12/8 belonged together. I feel like you can't talk about one without the other, just like 12/7 and 12/8/93. Q&U-5 (anyone remember that?)

Anyway, I think for the first Live Trax release, they 1,000% got it right with this show.
Wasn't at the show but I do have an emotional attachment to it because I was SO excited about this release and what it meant (a regular archival series) it was definitely an excellent kick off to the series. Listened to it so much when it came out. I think that's part of why my nose gets a little out of joint when it gets criticized
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Old 12-16-2020, 10:37 AM   #160
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Perhaps i am being too critical, or I am not articulating it well. Winter 98 is easily my favorite tour of the band, this show is fantastic, i dont love the one 2 second clip of #41 but I can deal. It never really stood out to me as the best DMB show of all time, but i think its a fantastic listen. 20+ years later I have some nits to pick about it and its release, but that hopefully does not take away from anyone else's opinion (or my own enjoyment) of the show.
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